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Was Just Thinking

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  • Was Just Thinking

    Theoretically, with the expansion of the universe at such a rate how can anyone still propose unlimited sources of energy? You'd think with the famous "e=mc^2" it couldn't be possible.

    I also found it hilarious to imagine a time in which the universe starts to collapse. Everything we've figured out scientifically would be null, seeing as how entropy would reverse.

    Also, what's up with all these movies about killer robots lately? Logic dictates that yes, in order to create a true, evolving and learning AI program you couldn't give it rules such as "don't kill humans," but wouldn't all the robots become insanely depressed before they even became self aware enough to kill? To endlessly serve a being that thinks nothing of you is a terrible existance. The robots would be trying to learn upon a human level, lacking the more advanced emotions we have or the ability to deal with such emotions. Thus, one would dictate that the main problem would be too many robots either commiting suicide or becoming to depressed to function.

    Two points about that. First, the only way to truely create AI to compair to us would be to incorporate the Thomas Hobbes view of the inherent evil humanity shows. An urge to be the best and to survive at no matter the cost, built into us but long since obsolete, its what makes us what we are today. Obviously that couldn't happen, or you'd get robots being just as scummy as most humans, thus worthless to us as tools or anything really. Second point, the only way a sentient robot could ever run would be the same way we do, quantum computing. Having a computer munipulate all 32 states of an electron for effeciency AND THEN calculate equations on a quantum scale is far beyond what we can do for a few hundred years at least. We just don't know enough about the subject to really build on it.

    Rant over.


    EDIT: was just made aware by butters (thanks) that there is a community / random posts place for this stuff wasnt aware. I just click forums on the swarm site and it brings me here and i post if you wish to move it you can or delete it or whatever it is you prefer
    Last edited by Ninja; 15 Jul 2004, 07:43 AM.
    My doctor says that I have a malformed public duty gland and a natural deficiency in moral fiber and that I am therefore excuse from saving the Universe

  • #2
    Robot pirates, thats the ticket!

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    • #3
      Hehe, is this a joke? "Ninja, Was Just Thinking" quickly! Put it to the mainpage...


      My head hurts, you watch too much Scifi...

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      • #4
        Stephen Hawking proposed the theory that entropy would continue to increase during the contraction phase, and that life can not exist in this contracting phase.
        And what unlimited souces of energy are you referring to?

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        • #5
          first off we need another nrg-source, that's true. but there are secrets hidden in water u cant imagine. in 2001 a philippinian (dont know whether that word is correct) built a car with a h2o-engine, where 5 litres (about 1 - 1.3 us-gallons i think) ran for about 500km (310 miles approx) - compared 2 gas: u need an average of 7 litres for 100km (calculate urself )... nother way is the cold fusion, which does work, but till now u put more nrg into it than u get out of it again (bout 70% return so far).

          the scientists are quite sure bout the universe not collapsing, it's tendency is to grow forever, still in a billion years for a small amount of time. it will stop at some point in the far, far future, coz the growth is almost infinitely slow, that a stable state will be achieved. u can discuss it tho, but the doctrine accords to my words here (but their english is better )... therefor i suggest u 2 read stephen hawking's "Brief History Of Time" and/or "The Universe In A Nutshell". all this stuff has been researched @ CERN, a giant research facility, where small amounts of the quark-gluon-plasma was reproduced - the plasma our universe consisted of about 13 billion years ago, a few seconds after the big bang. they therefor could reproduce the beginning of our universe and calculated a lot, just 2 find the mass needed to have the universe to stop to grow - our universe has just a lil bit above it. but read the books, tho.

          the quantum computing would open all gates to knowledge, because the quantum spin can cause a chain reaction in computing issues that ease computing. but the problem with quantum computing is the blurring between flavors and that the spin aint always defined exactly.

          well, i advise u to laugh bout my bad english, but i've tried to do as well as i could

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          • #6
            well first of all big bang is a theory that cant be proven...and your statement is true based on that theory...but ill explain where i was going with this


            e=mc^2 means that if something had unlimited energy, it would have unlimited mass. If something had unlimited mass, the universe would snap back to decreasing in size and entropy would end.

            the theory is just to see how much energy something could result in. It explains how a huge asteroid hitting earth would have so much energy it would destroy us, or how a tiny nuclear bomb could have such a huge explosion.

            However, the theory links energy to mass correct? As such, for there to be unlimited energy, you would have to get unlimited mass because they're directly linked. C^2 isn't even an issue, because c^2 times anything less than the infinite would still be less than infinite. The universe however is based off of the expansion on a molecular level, if something had unlimited mass then it would defy the expansion and elasticity of the growth of the universe, causing the universe to start collapsing. That would end entropy, everything would become more dense etc etc, we'll have to start from beginning again because our current models of physics and other sciences would no longer apply. I find that facinating and mind boggling to comprehend.
            My doctor says that I have a malformed public duty gland and a natural deficiency in moral fiber and that I am therefore excuse from saving the Universe

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            • #7
              Originally posted by Einstein
              And what unlimited souces of energy are you referring to?
              That's what I was wondering. I always thought the mass and energy of the universe was constant.

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              • #8
                well i was doing some read on e=mc^2, and some other science books, im by no means an expert...but the more i look at it e=mc^2 is prob going to be proven wrong, just because its using light as the fastest thing we can percieve. It'll suck when we figure all this out and the universe starts collapsing again, what a waste =/
                My doctor says that I have a malformed public duty gland and a natural deficiency in moral fiber and that I am therefore excuse from saving the Universe

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                • #9
                  there is no infinite energy source, I guess he is talking theoretically

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                  • #10
                    yes theoretically, because if there was an infinite energy source, it would have infinite mass therefore all the stuff im talking about would have happened.
                    My doctor says that I have a malformed public duty gland and a natural deficiency in moral fiber and that I am therefore excuse from saving the Universe

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                    • #11
                      another point to e=mc^2: in the beginning the universe expanded faster than c, this is where it gets tricky and the quark spin comes into the game: universe lies in a so-called multiverse, a huge thing of nothing - or it aint explainable to us, we dunno what is out of our borders. theories say it is sort of a quark-gluon-plasma-basic-substance. there might be other universes (imagine universes being atoms), influencing our one. well, the quark spin has caused an immense chain reaction, accelerating everything really mad, and therefor energy / mass was "created". universe unfolded in a real hurry, after small parts of a second the quarks united to electrons and stuff. all this might be created by the biggest of all universe powers, the gravity.
                      hard to figure out, what exactly happened , but there are masses of theories...

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                      • #12
                        Einstein will NEVER be proven wrong.

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                        • #13
                          Originally posted by Einstein
                          there is no infinite energy source, I guess he is talking theoretically
                          Oh. I see where he's going... I hate conversations involving infinity since it's just speculation. There is no infinity (or is there?) and proving it would... arrrgh you made me talk about infinity.

                          * leaves the thread *

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                          • #14
                            As I understand it, gravity is far far weaker than any other force in the known universe, it's specialness comes from the fact that it is strictly attractive, and also acts over huge distances; unlike some of the other forces. The other forces have both repulsive and attractive qualities which commonly serve to cancel them out.
                            My doctor says that I have a malformed public duty gland and a natural deficiency in moral fiber and that I am therefore excuse from saving the Universe

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                            • #15
                              Originally posted by Carth
                              Oh. I see where he's going... I hate conversations involving infinity since it's just speculation. There is no infinity (or is there?) and proving it would... arrrgh you made me talk about infinity.

                              * leaves the thread *

                              mind boggling isnt it....
                              My doctor says that I have a malformed public duty gland and a natural deficiency in moral fiber and that I am therefore excuse from saving the Universe

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