A Message From The Disgraced.

[Machine]

Dear All,

As you may have read in this thread :-

http://www.thieveryut.com/bb/viewtopic.php?t=752

I was a part of the clan called TheUnforgiven, a in my opinion an extremely misunderstood guild, who, because of the ignorance of a forum moderator have been thrown into chaos.

I still speak with a few players who I know to be in the TuF, and in light of recent events I have spoken to these players more frequently, 90% of these members are disbanding to their original guilds, the other 10% of members are ones who solely belong the TuF. The following are feelings of my own and those whom are currently scattering from the TuF Ranks.

I’d like to publicly thank you LaughingRat,

*Thank you for abusing your moderator rights to get me kicked from my guild, I have little argument for this, I walked the blade, I fell. BUT I had quit the guild and gone with Wraiths, I don’t blame Bill for kicking me, given the situation I would have done exactly the same thing, and I truly hope that there are no hard feelings between us, I will treat you all no differently.

*Thank you for instigating and fuelling the witchhunt that has lead to this point, which, as far as I can see was never initialised for any particular reason?! I mean, they’ve not even played a single match yet? OH I KNOW, your strike was pre-emptive, you know the problem with pre-emption is that you assume to much.

*Thank you for using your ability to identify people to increase your standing within the community, I’m sure many people out there will be awed by your power to identify anybody. I personally am disgusted that somebody in your position would be so quick to judge somebody. A PM to me would have cleared this up at least for me.

*Thank you for doing all this WITHOUT EVEN BLOODY ASKING THEM TO EXPOSE THEMSELVES. This could have been done via PM, which considering the seriousness of your accusations could have solved this issue without all these arguments.

*Thank you for posting my IP for all to see, I’ll be sure if I ever get admin rights that I am so liberal with the divulging of members personal details. I’ll be surprised if I can even play on any server tonight LR, thanks bud.

*Thank you for giving me ‘the benefit of the doubt’. I’ve been a player for, pfff I don’t know, maybe a year now, and I HAVE NEVER been associated with raging/cheating etc… IN FACT during my time as keeper admin I corresponded with mOdEtWo on an issue regarding a raging player on his server who had gotten an innocent player banned, the issue was resolved successfully and the offending player was identified.

*Thank you for destroying the mystery within the community, I hope it feels hollow.

And I must congratulate you on your uncanny ability to always come off looking the hero in your ‘announcements’. Well YAY for LaughingRat, all hail the great protector! Your arrogence sickens me.

I must take this opportunity to thank Omega, mOdEtWo, and Dalai whom despite having nothing to do with the TuF they have taken an extremely balanced view on their intentions. But for me the journey with TuF ended a while ago.

Also the other members of the community whom have very kindly contacted me with support for what has happened. I guess you don’t realise who your friends are until you need them, you know who you are, I wasn’t sure if you wanted me to name you so I didn’t.

The outcome of my destiny will become apparent before the end of this week, I’m looking forward to this new venture, and NO, it’s not with the TuF.

Why am I even arguing? It’s obvious this is a fight that I cannot win! Tomorrow will be the same…

I wish I could feel as though this was a justified move by LaughingRat, but the sensation of pure disgust and betrayal I’m feeling will not be quashed easily.

TheMachine.

P.S. LaughingRat, would you kindly remove my IP from the Guild section of the forums, your reasons for keeping them there are irrelevant, IMO you have a duty to protect the data you have access to, not broadcast it.

[-=V12US=-]

Geee, this all sure sounds familiar. :roll:

Oh, and Machine, I'd really hate it if you'd leave TUT because of this... perhaps a discussion between you and DarkBill will clear things up a bit.

[[RLF]Kore (V)acLoed]

Hey Machine,

First I must say I was truly shocked to hear about all of this. I regard The Machine as a good person. Someone I got along with and had fun playing with. I do feel a little betrayed with this situation. I can see your side to this though. Although I do not feel it "wrong" to have been in both guilds the "wrong part would have been in sharing information with each guild. I don't know if you had done the later but I must assume you did. Where you go from here is not my decision. What is my decision is my willingness to play with you on public servers. I still see you as a good person and a good player, and anytime you want to play with me I will be more then willing to.

I wish the best of luck to you and the other (damn spell check) ex-members of TUF. I hope the rest of the community can find it in their harts to forgive each one of you for what I would call bad decisions you had made.

[Machine]

Firstly Kore,

You have every right to feel betrayed, I can only apologise.

Secondly tho I do not know them all indiviually, I hope the Members of TuF who are disbanding do manage to do so without being identified. As for the rest, I hope I get the pleasure of playing against you on the servers!

to everyone else, I've not changed and *should* still be around permitting I'm still allowed on the servers, I don't see this as a problem as I've not broken any server rules as such.

[modetwo]

TheMachine, you (or an other TuF member) sent a mail to a CTG-member, saying that you would mis-use secret guild stuff. Now, isn't that a bit stupid?

I'm just asking you: Was that what you've planned?
Cause I can see WHY the guilds are mad at you, and at TuF. 'Spies' are not wanted, you should understand that!

Btw, you won't be banned at Mog's cause of this.

[Grank]

TM for one you're welcome to play on our server. We aren't out to get you guys banned. We are out to have Turf Wars be a fair and fun place to have guild wars.

LR is not the sole person in this btw. It was me who brought up this issue and several of the guild leaders who backed us up. If you want to blame someone then you have to blame us all to be fair.

From the letter you sent one of our members you make it perfectly clear that TUF is willing to infiltrate other guilds and steal their strategies BEFORE a match. This is just wrong. This isn't a witch hunt. This is us trying to make things fair for everyone.

This had to come out before TUF played a match. If you guys had played a match and then this was exposed then the guilds you had played would have felt cheated. It had the potential take the fun out of the Turf Wars. We all would have had a mess on our hands.

I have nothing personal against you TM. I actually like you and think you're a very skilled and respectful player. I do think you either crossed the line or made it known you would cross the line when it came to infiltrating the guilds. We gave TUF several days to explain themselves and come clean or set the record straight. TUF didn't take that opportunity so we had to act.

[Machine]

TheMachine, you (or an other TuF member) sent a mail to a CTG-member, saying that you would mis-use secret guild stuff. Now, isn't that a bit stupid?

Not that I expect anybody to believe such a lowely member as myself compared to the true and pure words of the lords Grank + LaughingRat. That statement has never existed in the standard recruitment letter which I initally composed and still resides on my hard disk.

Unless that letter has been manipulated or updated in some way since my leaving which i seriously doubt, then where has this extra information come from? besides the letter as I remember was issued some time ago.

You may bring concluesions as to what I am implying on your own, i'd probably be be-headed as a heretic if i make it any clearer.

[Curunir]

TM, stop being so dang defensive here and tying to make everyone feel sorry for you. No one ever said LR and Grank are "perfect little beings" and that you are a "lowley" as you put it. Most everyone, including Grank and LR respect you; as a great thief, and a great person. The only thing that has been brought up is the unfairness of the TUF's involvement in TurfWars. No one attacked you personally, so don't get so defensive and creating "Woe is me" threads and posts. No one here is "out to get you" or any other member of TUF. So far, no one has been banned from any servers as a result in their TUF involvement. So please, don't get all huffy-puffy about being found out.

[Grank]

TheMachine, you (or an other TuF member) sent a mail to a CTG-member, saying that you would mis-use secret guild stuff. Now, isn't that a bit stupid?

Not that I expect anybody to believe such a lowely member as myself compared to the true and pure words of the lords Grank + LaughingRat. That statement has never existed in the standard recruitment letter which I initally composed and still resides on my hard disk.

Unless that letter has been manipulated or updated in some way since my leaving which i seriously doubt, then where has this extra information come from? besides the letter as I remember was issued some time ago.

You may bring concluesions as to what I am implying on your own, i'd probably be be-headed as a heretic if i make it any clearer.

If you're implying that I doctored that message then thats what the bs is. If I need to I'll get a ss of the message ON the TUT boards. Be very careful TM. Don't call me a liar. We both know you wrote that letter and it's posted EXACTLY as you wrote it except our member's name was removed.

[Machine]

TM, stop being so dang defensive here and tying to make everyone feel sorry for you. No one ever said LR and Grank are "perfect little beings" and that you are a "lowley" as you put it. Most everyone, including Grank and LR respect you; as a great thief, and a great person. The only thing that has been brought up is the unfairness of the TUF's involvement in TurfWars. No one attacked you personally, so don't get so defensive and creating "Woe is me" threads and posts. No one here is "out to get you" or any other member of TUF. So far, no one has been banned from any servers as a result in their TUF involvement. So please, don't get all huffy-puffy about being found out.

I'm sorry if this was the impression go Curunir, I did not intend to generate pity for myself in any way, i was mearly trying to express that such players as Grank and LaughingRat whom have been around for some time do come accross as condesending and arrogant at times. I mean not to personally attack them, but this is a feeling many share.

I can fully apprecate the good that they may bring to the commuinity, defending from ragers/cheats etc... but so did we.

I don't think that anyone is 'out to get me' in anyway, in fact i have been plesently surpised on that front.

Ok, most importantly I'd like the IP's posted to be removed IMO thats personal information that should have never been disclosed, does that sound fair? Other than that unless somebody wishes to take things further the issue rests. I'd leave the TuF to do what they are doing, from what I hear from there remaining members they are pulling out of the Turf wars until they have made a full statement.

[modetwo]

I'm sorry if this was the impression go Curunir, I did not intend to generate pity for myself in any way, i was mearly trying to express that such players as Grank and LaughingRat whom have been around for some time do come accross as condesending and arrogant at times. I mean not to personally attack them, but this is a feeling many share.

Nah, I don't think many share that feeling. I think you've lost your vote from all the guild leaders and members - solely because you entered turfwars while being members at other guilds.

See this from Grank's or LR's (or any other guild leaders's) view for a minute. What would you do when you found out someone from a 'secret' guild was planning to infiltrate (or already had done so), AND you were supposed to fight a match against that 'secret' guild? Would you trust that secret guild, or any members in it? I don't think you would.

And, stop hitting at Grank, LR, or the CTG's. I guess many guilds are behind them on this one.

Still, I'm not being agains or with you - I was just disgusted over your infiltration plans!

[twistedzed]

We apologize, TwistedZed, was called away from the thread do to an emergency under the bridge.

[Ghostly apparition]

This is just an example of the kind of lame ass situations that come up with so many freaking ethics rules for a game about thieves. You guys like Laughing Rat and Crank are sad... so sad. You obviously have no life outside your servers and you struggle to feel important in your life. Well, you can ban and bother all the players right out of the game if you want. Pussies! It's a f-ing game. A psychologist would have a field day on you nerds... probably link your social issues back to child molestation or abuse.

But I do love reading what you guys have to say. It reminds me how much better my life is. So go ahead... post your pussy complaints and lame counter-arguments. It will give me something to laugh about today.

TwistedZed

Yeah, Your life is so great that you post rager comments on the board yourself,
take a good hard look in the mirror. A Psycologist would have a fun time with you
as well.

if you can't post something that is relevent to the situation maybe you shouldn't
post at all.

[LaughingRat]

TM, I think you're an extremely skilled player, and fun to play with. It has never been my intent to drive you out of the community. Rather, I hope you'll stay, as I think you're quite an asset to it.

However, you have made some mistakes (as have we all). Placing TuF in a situation to match was just a poor judgement, particularly after stating in a recruitment letter to a guild member that you intended to use information about what a guild was planning in a match.

No one is getting banned from any servers as a result of this (as far as I'm aware - I'll take issue with any server admin who does it, but Grank and I won't be doing that).

As far as those IP's go - since you've said in another post that you're not up on this internet stuff - let me fill you in. You're on a dialup service. That means you're assigne an IP every time you connect to your provider. They assign you that IP from a block they have reserved, based on what's available. Due to the rather large block of IP's your provider has reserved, the number of IP's you can be assigned is pretty staggering. The chance that anyone could do anything to you with one of those 4 IP's is virtually non-existent. I took this into consideration when I posted them, and only left them there because it poses no threat to you whatsoever. If it did, I'd have removed them.

Now let me make a suggestion: You've put a fair amount of work into TuF, why not keep it up? Make your membership open, and keep operating as a team? You have some good members, and I think TuF COULD be an asset to the community in this role.

[Machine]

This is just an example of the kind of lame ass situations that come up with so many freaking ethics rules for a game about thieves. You guys like Laughing Rat and Crank are sad... so sad. You obviously have no life outside your servers and you struggle to feel important in your life. Well, you can ban and bother all the players right out of the game if you want. Pussies! It's a f-ing game. A psychologist would have a field day on you nerds... probably link your social issues back to child molestation or abuse.

But I do love reading what you guys have to say. It reminds me how much better my life is. So go ahead... post your pussy complaints and lame counter-arguments. It will give me something to laugh about today.

TwistedZed

(holds head in hands)

Please ignore this post.