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  • #16
    Originally posted by -KewlAzMe- View Post

    then the torch can be thief frobbed and taken. Forcing guards to only take the torch when they are competent enough to handle it.
    Competent Guards? against a gang of thugs..erm DM thieves like thievery became at the end? LOL

    Originally posted by -KewlAzMe- View Post
    Part of the idea process is Brainstorming. The first step is to throw out many ideas and then discuss them and see different points of view that some people may not have thought about... or see how one spin on an idea can be changed a different way. They don't even have to make sense at first, as maybe there is just one part that might be able to work in this game genre.

    Lets not worry about what could or couldn't hurt the game until everyone has had a chance to comment.. its not LouieBlade, its NightBlade... and just cuz an idea is out there doesn't mean that it's going to be added. It would take a majority vote... or at least a vote by the devs to include something.. but its still worthwhile to throw ideas out there and discuss them.
    Just make an updated Thievery with better graphics for louie to play and lets get on with nightblade for the rest of us.

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    • #17
      Originally posted by Ghostly apparition View Post
      Just make an updated Thievery with better graphics for louie to play and lets get on with nightblade for the rest of us.
      Bingo!
      I'd Be More Apathetic... If I Wasn't So Lethargic

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      • #18
        Ghostly Apparition and Louie just need to take this argument outside and get it over with. Now this thread is going to go on for 5 pages!

        I love the torch idea, but I agree with Machine on the rushing. I think rushing is awesome. If thieves can bolt headlong into a guarded mansion while the guards are still putting their underwear on and bail with the loot, more power to them. I'm quite a bit more cautious by nature, but the very few rushes I have pulled off, I never felt like a lesser taffer for it, especially with one drop left

        As far as game balance, I'm torn. I've been playing Thief 2 on expert and there are several missions where flares are mandatory equipment, (for a thief!). I can't recall any guards with torches though. I think that came in Deadly Shadows. In short, there's precedent for flares and torches in the thief series. Water arrows were the counter for both, in the Thief series and in Thievery.

        I don't like KAM's idea of the combo lock on a torch though. It's overly complicated for what should be the simplest of guard equipment. If lords are going to put combo locks on torches outside, I would expect the actual valuables inside the mansion would all be behind a safe and an Ocean's Eleven style vault job would be required to get it out. Complete with Chinese contortionist.

        If the combo lockbox for torches idea were instituted though, I agree, the thieves should be able to pick it.

        What about using the supply box to supply torches instead? I haven't played NB online, but I don't recall a supply chest for guards.

        Or should the guards be more modern and use bull's eye lanterns that would be much harder to dowse? The Mechanists made a submarine, after all...

        And to further complicate the issue, has anyone considered the gas lamp? The Mechanists used them in the Kidnap mission of Thief 2. A torch-snuffer mod could be used on those, simulating they ran out of fuel.

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        • #19
          Originally posted by SPIDER View Post
          Ghostly Apparition and Louie just need to take this argument outside and get it over with. Now this thread is going to go on for 5 pages!
          Resurrection?! Ghostly and Louie have had tons of new arguments since this one.

          Originally posted by SPIDER View Post
          I don't like KAM's idea of the combo lock on a torch though. It's overly complicated for what should be the simplest of guard equipment. If lords are going to put combo locks on torches outside, I would expect the actual valuables inside the mansion would all be behind a safe and an Ocean's Eleven style vault job would be required to get it out. Complete with Chinese contortionist.

          If the combo lockbox for torches idea were instituted though, I agree, the thieves should be able to pick it.
          I really don't remember saying anything about a combo lock.. but the thread is too old for me to remember.

          All the same, if I did offer the idea of a combo lock... I don't like that idea either.
          I'd Be More Apathetic... If I Wasn't So Lethargic

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          • #20
            There is no guard footlocker/supply closet/etc at the moment, I really should add something for the moment as guards will run out of stuff over a match.

            Regarding torches/flares - there are all sort of ideas I'ld like to try out in this space, such as each guard having a torch that us lit off of wall torches and lasts 10-20 seconds before needing to be relit. That might make things interesting as guards will need to stick close to the lit areas to be able to search the shadows. I'm leaving this alone for the moment though as there are some more important things to do.
            Immortius' Forge

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            • #21
              Torch > Flares

              Quite a few parameters to play with here.

              Wieldable Torch
              Can be used in conjunction with sword.
              Cannot be used in conjunction with crossbow.
              Takes 3 seconds to light from an existing flame.
              Lasts for a duration of 20 seconds (fuel-meter displayed).
              Can re-light torches in 3 seconds.
              Can burn moss off caltrops in 5 seconds (if moss & trops become part of the game).
              Can be doused by water arrow, or by drawing crossbow.
              Extinguishes when guard is KO'ed.

              If you decide to go with torches, I wouldn't bother adding a supply chest/locker unless you want players to be able to replenish standard bolts.

              You could just give guards more starting bolts and force them to ration them over the match. If match-time is dropped to <15 minutes that could work nicely.
              .: Daymaster - Mockers Thievery Guild :.

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              • #22
                If it you could hold it like a weapon then you'd want to be allowed to clobber thieves with it too.

                Maybe you could also make spiders scared of it so they back away when you move it in close proximity to them.

                A club that lets you bash thieves and set thieves alight would be fun, counterbalanced of course with water arrows and the suggested lit duration limit.

                Though I think 20 is too high, I'd say 10-15 would be better (yes in text that sounds like hardly any difference, but in-match that's a very large reduction).
                [E.D.G]Chief

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                • #23
                  You'd first need to oil them somehow to set em ablaze.

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                  • #24
                    Realism! My greatest foe!

                    I could probably chuck some explanation against it like guards are carrying around plenty of oil, but they can't reapply it while the torch is lit.
                    Immortius' Forge

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                    • #25
                      Not an issue then, what about oiling thieves then

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                      • #26
                        That would waste all your oil though. Lord Belford would be most displeased.
                        Immortius' Forge

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                        • #27
                          Can we smash thieves with our torch, setting them ablaze?
                          I'd Be More Apathetic... If I Wasn't So Lethargic

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                          • #28
                            Its like asking if we can set em ablaze with flares

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                            • #29
                              Originally posted by FatRatHead View Post
                              Its like asking if we can set em ablaze with flares
                              Well.. try it.. go light a flare and put it to your skin... then try it with a torch..

                              Lemme know how that works out for you.
                              I'd Be More Apathetic... If I Wasn't So Lethargic

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                              • #30
                                Well I'd been hit by a flaming torch and didn't catch on fire...
                                And you should count in that thieves often are wet and their missions (in Tut and DE) usually contained some swimming or water.

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