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Thieves: too much advantage?

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  • Thieves: too much advantage?

    Hi, guys. I'm new to this forum, but I've been playing UT: Thievery for months. I took some time off from it, but I'm glad my return has yielded some new releases and bug fixes. However, I still find some of the old gripes have still gone unrepaired.

    Don't get me wrong, I love Thievery. But after a couple games the past few nights, I can't help but feel that the guards are at a significant disadvantage. "NO, THEY'RE NOT!" you may say, but you really need to look at what it takes to even detect a thief.

    For starters, why is it we can't hear a thief unless he's on soft terrain? Do you know how hard it is to hear a thief on hardwood floors? With available rugs to run on, it's that much more difficult. The perpetual run mode not only makes it hard to chase and track a thief, but there is no penalty for running as a thief. In most other FPS games, espcially the original Thief, running is the benefit of increased speed at the cost of louder footsteps. This is absent in Thievery.
    Thieves' footsteps should be more audible.

    Second, what's with the total cloaking effect for thieves? They wear dark colors as it is, which is hard to distinguish with the naked eye, but TOTAL CLOAKING?!?! This was cool when Thievery first came out, but you'd think that with more and more players getting on that having one team be naturally invisible would be a severe imbalance. Games like Counter Strike have dark attire that is hard as hell to see in shadows. Why didn't they do that with Thivery? Plus, have you ever seen a thief run in and out of lights? I haven't either because the spin up of the cloak changeover takes too long to register the thief's invisibilty/visibility to the guards. A thief can run in and out of light for about a second and he can still remain cloaked. I think this suggestion can fix that.
    Remove total cloaking; replace it with darker thief attire

    These are my only gripes with Thievery. If the devs could even consider these changes, I'm sure a great deal of the Thievery community wouldn't mind the changes. Thieves would still be able to skulk about in the shadows with only the true thieves being invisible ; noobs would reveal themselves in reckless and sloppy form. Guards could maintain their status as slow beasts, but at least they'd have a fighting chance now. No more completely invisible thieves. Cloaking isn't part of the Metal Age. I mean, c'mon, they just now started making rudimentary robots...

  • #2
    I can hear thief footsteps just fine (and they ARE louder when running, you honestly can't hear that?), and see them when running into and out of shadows all the time. Maybe increase your volume, and get a better sound and/or vidcard?

    Simply making dark thief attire doesn't solve the visibility problem, either. Plyaers could simply adjust their monitor's gamma way up, and the darker attire wouldn't matter. Not to mention that darker attire doesn't help at all when silhouetted against a brighter area.


    • #3
      You can see a thief down to around 5-10% before they go complety invinsible
      Did they not do this they would always be visible to a guard with a keen eye.


      • #4
        These ideas r bad

        Play the game a bit longer and come back to us, Saureco.


        • #5
          Welcome to TUT community Saureco. Play nice, have fun.

          About thieves. Thieves become overpowered when they work as a team. other than that, no, they are not too hard to find or beat. What I think that needs a bit of tweaking is the damage of the sword. It has happened to me to hit a thief about six times and he finally got away! :lol:
          I Need Training!


          • #6
            welcome to the Forums!

            Must disagree with your comments though.

            There are penalties for thieves when they run. They are louder, as well as more visible. Not sure why your system does not indicate this, but could be numerous reasons. I will assume you are using a good card. Do you use speakers or headphones? What eq/tone settings do you have? what kind of frequency responce do they have? How easy is it for you game sounds (primarily loudness, but enviroment, speaker quality, etc factor in here)?

            Taking away the cloak would make the game impossible for theives, and make it more a combat game unless map lighting is seriously re-tooled in all maps. A thief skilled in the art of ghosting can move about without guards of lesser skill finding them. Thye can be found however- it requires simply more then trying to see them. KNowledge of the map, insticts, sounds, situational awareness, etc, all factor in. I have been found out based on such skills, and have also found thieves using such skills. It requires more thought then the traditional FPS, but that's why I like the game.

            I do not think theives are overpowered. Some would say that the guards are overpowered. This more a question for the server admins who keep stats on such things. If the overall ratio is lopsided in favor of the thieves, one could argue that the thieves are overpowered. I believe it actully is close to even however. Out of curiousity all ye server admins, what is the overall theif/guard win ratio? the per map ratio? Would be interesting to see.
            Give some taffer fire, and you'll keep him warm for the night with one less reason to cause trouble for the master.
            Set a taffer on fire, and he will be warm for the rest of his life, and have no need to bother the master.


            • #7
              After playing some more, especially as a guard, I find that my suggestions were presumptuous. Instead, I found out what was really wrong:

              I JUST PLAIN SUCK!! How about that, huh? Yeah, apparently my Thivery skills aren't up to par with a lot of other players, especially since my 3-month hiatus. I guess... make that we ALL guess I haven't been playing enough. After 2 quick rounds today, I had my ass handed to me quite a few times.

              So, lets forget this thread, and I'll just go back to trying to pull myself out of the land of crap skills and see if I can somehow stumble into the garden of decent skill.

              Thanks for the welcome, by the way. Guess I'll be seeing you guys in game, probably from the pointy ends of your swords! :grin:


              • #8
                Heh, well it shows something when a person can admit his own mistakes. You're right, your suggestions were presumptuous. But you know that already, so there's no need for us to hammer it in more.

                I hope to see you in-game!!


                • #9
                  Hey Saureco welcome to the TuT community!!!
                  I hope you will have fun with tut...

                  You have the silence of the elephant... :grin:
                  "Blockheads never learn, Clever learn by his own mistakes, Intelligents learn by mistakes of others."


                  • #10
                    These are the amount of Theif and Guard wins on our server since 1.4. The thieves have a slight edge. I would call this pretty even.

                    ThiefWins=3618 52%
                    GuardWins=3339 48%


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by Grank
                      These are the amount of Theif and Guard wins on our server since 1.4. The thieves have a slight edge. I would call this pretty even.

                      ThiefWins=3618 52%
                      GuardWins=3339 48%
                      I think its perfect. Why? Sometimes where there is just one player on the server he wins the map (only by thief) when he waits for other players. So substract some ThiefWins from the score and its almost perfect even!
                      In the Future, One Duck Is The Law.


                      • #12
                        I'd say guards win, mostly. But, yes, Grank has a point. Things are pretty even and I'm not disagreeing with it. Just play fair, and you won't see me whining around.


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by Lurox
                          But, yes, Grank has a point.
                          That was a fact, not a point.


                          • #14
                            In all reality, when the server is FULL, the guard/thief win ratio is more like 70/30.
                            Unfortunately, the server is rarely full :|
                            .:Mockers Thievery Guild:.
                            - "Earth dons the red; calls the maggots."


                            • #15
                              Depends on when you play Shadow Rodent, there have been plenty of times the server has been full, or I have to wait to get in till the next round.