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A cry for help; this is killing me!

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  • A cry for help; this is killing me!

    Okay, so I've been working on Th-Bankjob a lot recently, but in the past couple days I've been forced to backtrack almost every time I rebuild my geometry.

    It seems that some objects cause the rebuild, and therefore UnrealEd to crash, and I have to think about what I've added/subtracted since my last rebuild to narrow it down, and just delete things until the rebuild works. I wouldn't mind this as much if I didn't have 3,000+ brushes that it had to crash through every time (though I definitely still would mind it). The crash happens at the last bar of Illumination Occluding, after it sits there for ~30 secs. The error message I receive is as follows:
    "Assertion failed: Frame->Level->Nodes.Num()<=MAX_NODES [File:C:\UTDev\Render\Src\UnRender.cpp][Line:2337]"

    MAX_NODES really scares me.
    Oh how I so do hope that my map isn't too big to be worked on any longer.

    Please help! I offer my greatest gratitude for any help at all.
    Predator
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  • #2
    Nodes are the coloured polygons on the BSP 3d view. There's a max number of them. The number of then can be reduced by removing brushes or making them semi-solid (semi-solid brushes don't create bsp cuts).
    Immortius' Forge

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    • #3
      Well, unfortunately I didn't consult many tutorials or mapping guides before I began work, so I never even used a semi-solid brush. Do semi-solids still cast shadows?

      Have you intersected/de-intersected any brushes so they are more complex after the operation than before? Any odd use of solid brushes, like odd angles, or square solids that have many/all asymmetrical sides? Many off grid brushes?
      For the same reasons I've described above, I have done most of these things.

      I have 65,334 nodes, with a ratio of 1.95:1

      A max number of nodes is a horrible, horrible problem especially where I am now. Even if I made all my furniture semi-solids I still have a lot of work to do around this city. Wow, I can't even imagine having to stop here.
      Predator
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      • #4
        Wow, if it really can be used for that much, that would surely be a huge help. Thank you both very very much

        Edit: Amazing! My map will now rebuild, and my nodecount is way lower even after just a few minutes of semisolidifying

        I don't know what I'd do without you guys. It may just seem like an easy question answered to you but the help you've just given me has really made my day, because I was seriously worried that there may have been no hope that I could continue work on my map, and I thank you very much. I owe yah
        Predator
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        • #5
          Well, at least it's not a destructive thing, changing to semi-solids, so in the mean time, I'll just keep doing it, since, well, it allows my map to work
          Predator
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          • #6
            As I recall, there is performance a trade-off when using semi-solids. As they are not part of the BSP tree, htey tend to slow performance down in-game. If the map seems to have performance problems in an area with lots of semi-solids, that might be something to look at.

            Do have any brushes with many vertexes? The 2d editor and the terrain builder can make such brushes. Might be a source of your problems.
            Give some taffer fire, and you'll keep him warm for the night with one less reason to cause trouble for the master.
            Set a taffer on fire, and he will be warm for the rest of his life, and have no need to bother the master.

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            • #7
              I've once, and only once, seen someone die by cratering on the semisolid desk in the doctor's room in Th-Asylum. Most of the time there's no problem though.
              Immortius' Forge

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              • #8
                Originally posted by immortius
                I've once, and only once, seen someone die by cratering on the semisolid desk in the doctor's room in Th-Asylum. Most of the time there's no problem though.
                Sure it wasn't one of those damned books' fault? They've cratered me a few times...
                It's not my fault everything you like is terrible.

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                • #9
                  If its small and complex make it semisolid. If its big and key component of architecture (roofes, walls and similar stuff) make it solid.

                  Btw lotsa nodes that O.<
                  My leet Thievery Map
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                  • #10
                    How big IS your map then? My god, max nodes? Never had that haha. Good that you sorted it out though.
                    On demand this signature has been changed. I hope nobody was insulted or got harmed due to my signature. If this is the case, I'm fully responsible for the harm that was done. Do you feel harmed or you simply want a listening ear?

                    Call 0900-PHAE

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                    • #11
                      Something that's helped me in some cases to reduce polys and nodes, is to use actors for complex things (like furniture), disable collision and use invisible semi-solids instead. Depending on the object (and the complexity of collision you want), it could only take one or two brushes instead of having a slow bsp object (causing bsp holes too ) .
                      <-- Resident Nightblade suggestion attorney...

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                      • #12
                        Thanks a lot for the help guys, it seems that semi-solids have been doing great so far, so if I find that I have any trouble I can just convert them back to solids I suppose.

                        Phae- My map, in the xy viewport isn't actually all that huge, but it's a city, where every building within the city borders can be entered, so it's taking quite a few brushes needless to say

                        Firetiger- I would go with the decoration route, but I really enjoy making great looking shadows, so decos really aren't my bag. I'm sure in, say, the chapel, I'd use them for the pews however.
                        Predator
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                        • #13
                          Originally posted by Firetiger
                          Use actors for complex things (like furniture), disable collision and use invisible semi-solids instead.
                          Beware the black holes!

                          No seriously, has anyone ever seen this? When i made many of those ICH's in a tight spot it always caused an area which had weird light behavior and killed the player when he approached them.
                          My leet Thievery Map
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                          • #14
                            Well, the same error has happened again, and my nodecount is even significantly lower than before. If an experienced Ued user wouldn't mind taking a look at my map to perhaps try their hand at fixing the problem or pointing out obvious design flaws, that would be great. It scares me whenever stuff like this happens, because it's hard to tell if the program will even enable me to finish. If anyone is interested, just post here and I'll pm you a link. I don't plan to give it to maybe 1 or 2 people so if you just want to take a peek at the map please refrain. I'd really appreciate your help. Thanks again for the help you've already given me as well.
                            Predator
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                            • #15
                              Email it to your old friend Mord, he'll give it a shoofty.
                              Mordengaard - Tester/Mapper/Voice Actor/Nitpick/Coder

                              "Criminal: A person with predatory instincts who has not sufficient capital to form a corporation."
                              :: Howard Scott

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